"I have nothing against these grand ambitions, but I think we are limiting ourselves when it comes to the potential of systems thinking and system change work if we only look at these huge changes. And in fact, even the big changes I think can only be achieved by tackling smaller systemic issues in the right sequence in a clever way."

Odin Mühlenbein is a partner at Ashoka Germany and also the Co-Lead of the Systems Unit at Ashoka Globalizer. He’s also the co-author of a recent report, From Small to Systemic which looks at the multi-billion euro potential in social innovation. On the Podcast In Too Deep Odin talks about his experiences, the potential of systems change work, and how Lord of the Rings can help you develop good impact strategies.

You can hear the Podcast here or read the transcript here.